Melt downs | Autism PDD

I ALSO DO THE SAME BEHAVIOURS THAT MY CHILDREN DO AND SOMETIMES THEY ARE SO CAUGHT UP IN ME DOING IT THEY STOP AND WONDER AWAY LOLIts ok to laugh! I was laughing when I was typing the part about my mom. Shes one of those people who know a little bit about everything and when you double check what she says it never matches up. hehe
Is everyone on this board in Georgia? I can't remember where I found this, but I know I was doing a Georgia search.  Anywho!
Williams teacher said he had a fairly good day, but I wanted to talk more with her about setting up a schedule for him and teaching him time with a watch. I emailed her about it though so maybe we can get started with that Monday.
He REALLY needs to learn when to go to potty. Its not easy changing an 8 year old!
His teacher makes him wear his boxers at school and they try to make him go 3-4 hours between potty breaks, but when he has an accident they just change him into another pair and he really doesn't care either way.  So rather than me having to wash dozens of boxers a week for him I dont see why they can't just use his pull ups and still take him to potty on his schedule.  Sometimes I wonder if people stop to think for any lengthy amount of time. hehe

You would think that I would have started researching more about Autism before now considering William was diagnosed at 2, but I had some awful experiences with different doctors in the beginning. We used the babies can't wait program and they were great. Lots of therapist coming out to the house to work with him, but once he turned 3 that stopped and the AWFUL public school system took over.
I see my own mental health (for lack of better wording) getting in the way of my research and I've recently found myself wondering if maybe Williams autism is something I've passed down or even if he was misdiagnosed.
I mean most Autistic children have a fairly good vocabulary..right?

No..not everyone is in Georgia...there are people from all over the world here. lol  A lot from the US though.

Karrie

Well Crap!  LOL
I thought I had found a local Autism message board thing.
When I had AOL back 5 or so years ago I had found a local group.
I try to find things online that I can get involved in and learn from since
I have social issues.   This one has lots of topics going on that I like
reading about. So I guess I'll forgive you all for not being local.

[QUOTE=gdanes]Well Crap!  LOL
I thought I had found a local Autism message board thing.
When I had AOL back 5 or so years ago I had found a local group.
I try to find things online that I can get involved in and learn from since
I have social issues.   This one has lots of topics going on that I like
reading about. So I guess I'll forgive you all for not being local.

LOL.....I have social issues too. It's called foot in mouth syndrome...I try and stay out of public as much as possible...LOL And I sometimes come across as too blunt I've been told. Oops

Karrie

karjab3039311.6621296296[quote="gdanes"]I dont suppose you have any advice for annoying parents do you?
My parents, well my mom keeps saying that one day William will snap out of the Autism. I've tried explaining to her that it isn't that simple, but she believes that with prayer he will one day just snap out of it. I've pretty much given up on trying to teach her anything about it and I just agree and nod at what shes saying.
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I laugh, but I guess it's not all that funny. If I had the answer to that one, I'm fairly certain my own life would be less stressful. Everyone seems to think that the problem just disappears as you grow older, as though it's some sort of childhood brattiness or something. Try explaining his problems to people when he's 25 and supposed to be venturing out into the world as an adult.

Sorry -- I didn't mean to vent. It's just that I have nearly lost my patience with people who refuse to make an effort understand, and I'm dealing with a few of them right now. I wish I had a better answer for you because I feel his (and your) pain all the way from here.

As for the Kaitlyn issue -- from your last response, it definitely looks to me like Wiliam sees Kaitlyn's ability to affect his environment by talking to you. You'll have to find a way to convince him that Kaitlyn is not always talking about him or tattling on him. Otherwise the only way to keep him from spazzing is if she's out of his earshot when she talks to you. It won't be an easy fix because Kaitlyn is not old enough to understand what's happening.

Since William probably does not realize when he's doing something that needs correcting, he may be assuming that she's "telling" on him even when he hasn't done anything to warrant it (in other words, he's guessing because he does not know what she might tell on him for). He may remember being unexpectedly pulled away from his beloved computer immediately following Kaitlyn asking if she could use it, so since he didn't really understand what happened (other than the fact that he was thrown into panic) or what Kaitlyn actually said, all he can do now is assume that she is getting him "in trouble" when he hears her talk to you.

Good luck with this one. Let me know how things work. The more I know about William's functioning level and habits, the easier it will be to compare his experiences with my own. There may be something that can ease his fear that we haven't picked up on yet.   My brother is 11 and has melt downs. I try everything but when it comes its here to stay for a while, unless you wave ice cream in his face. I'm wondering does anyone have any suggestions for what other methods I can try?

Daysha

Welcome!

How old are you? It's great you want to help your brother!

Maybe try rewards for no meltdowns. Catch the trigger before it starts into meltdown mode.

Others here may have better suggestions. My son is 7.5y and it's a struggle for us with meltdowns also!!

diversion works well hun

when he is kicking off offer a toy sing a song anything he likes

love shell

Thanks I have tried the toys but then sometimes I think he has a fit because he thinks he'll get something from it. I haven't tried the singing though he loves classical musicpersonally for me, growing up, i would want to be totally isolated from everyone, want to be in my room, alone. Nobody to talk to me, offer me things, even look at me. When it was over, id discuse the situation but now how i acted during the meltdown itself. Growing up, my parents never had information regarding autism, they had a few things of course, but nothing compaired to the info that exists today. When I had a meltdown, after a while as when I was little i was allowed to have my flip, but around 5-6 it stopped being tolerated, if i did this as school, it was to the principals, mom and dad was called and i was in trouble when i got home. If i did it at home i would be yelled at, told to stop acting up, get sent to my room (this was actually a good thing) and probably loose tv time or get to go outside, just making the problem worse. I love my parents dearly, but they made alot of mistakes, well... different times i guess.

I think this is one of the reasons later in life i kinda pushed all of my anger, problems down, i repressed stuff, and as an adult, im good at not having meltdowns, i can handel problems and remove myself from situations usually. My main issues happen at work, because im a good worker, and very compident and productive, im allowed a break if things get outa hand, my bosses know sometimes when their is too much going on and maby ppl are getting to me, i need to chill, he really does not want me to get angry and quit, as has happened once already.

Everyone is different, but for me, and i wish my parents could understand, when i was having a meltdown i was not acting out, i was shutting down, i was releasing the stress, the rage, now, i know i have to chill out more, years of pushing everything down, my anger, problems, repressing potential meltdowns is bad, it can cause an emotional explosion, or health problems (how i dont have an ulcer is beyond me, hehe). I really wish when I was having a meltdown they would allow me time to myself without getting into trouble for a behavior as a child i could not control. Adults are different, i cant meltdown now, one cant use autism as an excuse in the real world i find, especally if they are at the function level i am at. One must cope, form strategys.

Ok sorry, i get ahead of the topic often, no more rambling, hehe.

NOTE: I was DX'ed with HFA when I was little, however in the late 80's aspringers as a disorder was not recognized, i understand that now, the difference between HFA and aspringers is that aspringers have above average intelligence (they can function better in society) whereas HFA may have lower IQ's and its evident they are different). I honestly beleive if i was to get a new eval as an adult (last time was 16 years ago) that i would have the aspie dx, i function almost normal, and so, i think me and your bro may be alot alike. Others like rainman and stickboy had HFA as kids, also would pass for aspie, at least stickboy has said this, i never asked rainman.

It's nice you're trying to help your brother, but you're a kid too so I hope the adults in your family are taking the biggest share of responsibility when it comes to your brother's care. 

I usually share a list of articles on meltdowns, but they're college-level reading so I thought I'd share my personal meltdown strategy instead:

Why do meltdowns occur?

Sensory:  One thing that often causes meltdown is being overwhelmed by lots of noise, sights, smells and other sensory input.  Life at our house got easier when I figured out the things that bother my son and helped him avoid and deal with them better.  You might be able to help your brother by knowing what senses tend to bother him.  Ask your parents about what they've noticed.

Stress:  Kids with autism have a lot of stress in their lives every single day, from trouble communicating, trouble with sensory input, and sometimes trouble sleeping and even knowing when they should eat. 

I help my son avoid meltdown by watching his stress level -- otherwise some small frustration like dropping his pencil might trigger a big explosion.  It's not that the pencil was so important, it's just that it was the straw that broke the camel's back and gave him more stress than he could handle. 

How can I tell that a meltdown is on the way?

I look for signs that my son's stress level is building, and help him take a break when he needs one.  Your brother has his own signs, but here are my son's signs:

overreacting to normal frustrations

stuttering more

talking louder/making noise (ultimately screaming or crying)

making sudden movements, getting restless

pacing, trying to run off

covering his ears, hiding

obsessing on something, can't be reasoned with

What can I do when a meltdown happens?

This is what works for me:

1.  Stay calm.  Meltdowns are stressful for everyone in the family, but if we  stay calm, the meltdown will go away quicker.

2.  Remove him from the situation and take him to a safe, quiet place.

3.  Don't ask questions, just give support in as few words as possible.  Questions are frustrating, since kids that are melting down have an extra hard time using their words.  They might not even catch what you're saying.  But it does help to say things like "I see you're pretty upset" and "I'm on your team."  Never say he's overreacting or that his feelings are silly.  He's having a hard time, and his feelings are very real to him.

4.  Stay close by to listen to him and snuggle when he's ready.

Good luck with everything.  I'll be thinking of you.

[quote="gdanes"]He LOVES the computer. The first thing he wants to do when he gets up in the morning is to get on the computer and he cries when he has to leave it for school. He screams constantly at school when the teachers try to make him interact and sit down to do his work because there is a computer in the room and he wants to be on it. Then when we come home from school I dont even get everything in the door and he's already at the computer again.
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Can he tell time? I remember learning to anticipate activity changes by expecting them to happen at certain times of the day (i.e. I left for school at 7:45 so I knew if I got done with breakfast at 7:25 and I wanted to draw or play video games, I had to be able to put a stop to it in 20 minutes). I may not have liked the particular activity that was coming up, but if I anticipated it at a particular time, at least I had the chance to get over it before it actually happened. You may be right in that he may feel that the computer is the only thing he feels successful at, and he may not ever expect to be pulled off the computer at a particular time. Once he gets into his games, he may become so engrossed in tehm that he loses touch with all other stimuli. So when one comes along (like you telling him it's time to go to school), it catches him off guard and he is unable to redirect himself in time to avoid meltdown.

I think it's very important that he learn how to read a digital watch. That way he can begin to learn what time he leaves for school, what time lunch is, what time bedtime is, etc. so that he will be able to predict these environmental changes. If he programs for them in advance, they may not be so overwhelming when they actually happen. The more repetitive stimuli should become scripted in his mind, leaving him only to process the smaller details that may vary from day to day. With less information to process at once, he should not get overwhelmed as often.

As for the sister thing, I don't really know enough details to make a call on that one. The only thing I can think of is that maybe Kaitlyn has been known to say things about William to you that cause you to change what William is doing, and he is beginning to pick up on that. He may see her telling you something, assume it is about him, fear a response from you, and panic because he does not know what this perceived "response" will involve. Maybe he feels that if he stops Kaitlyn from saying her piece, he can prevent a change in his environment. That's only a wild guess because I don't really know your kids. But that's all I can think of. I know I tend to feel panicky when I think someone may be whispering something about me to someone who has the ability to change my environment.wow..
I never thought about that.. The problem with his sister started roughly 2 months or so ago and she was tattling on him a lot for getting into things or telling me she wanted to use the computer so I was making them take turns. That probably really made him mad.  That makes sense now.  I'll try getting Kaitlyn to say some positive things and then give William some type of reward when she says it.  Hopefully that will help to make her voice tolerable again.
The watch is a great idea too!  I know at school they are working on the pecs system, which he doesn't like at all.  So he has to put the right card on the right area and tell the teacher what time it is as far as lunch time or P.E., etc..
As far as I know he doesn't actually understand how to tell time, but he LOVES numbers so I think that is a great idea about the digital watch!
The advice you have given is great and it makes me wonder why the heck I didn't see these things. I see as I get older I become more closed minded and less open to things going on around me, which isn't in Williams favor. :(

I dont suppose you have any advice for annoying parents do you?
My parents, well my mom keeps saying that one day William will snap out of the Autism.  I've tried explaining to her that it isn't that simple, but she believes that with prayer he will one day just snap out of it.  I've pretty much given up on trying to teach her anything about it and I just agree and nod at what shes saying.
I think faith is important, but I think being reasonable is equally important. I'm afraid my parents aren't accepting that this is something we all need to learn about and educate ourselves on so that we can better help him.
They wanted to take my children to the beach in Florida next month, but said they couldn't handle Williams behavior (the meltdowns). So..in order for the kids to be able to go their father is going with them so my parents dont freak out. 
I have some issues of my own (that I refuse to go to the doctor for) that I'll have to deal with when while my babies are that far away from me, but at least its only for 3 days!

[QUOTE=gdanes]
My main concern with William right now is how he reacts when his sister speaks.
Kaitlyn is 5 years old and anytime she tries to talk to me around William he gets VERY upset. He screams and covers his ears and if she doesn't stop he marches over and tries to stick his elbow in her mouth or cover her mouth with his hand.
I can't tell if he's jealous of her being able to talk so well or if her voice just irritates him for some reason.  I have seen him get upset with another little girl, but its usually just Kaitlyn.  I feel so bad telling her no talking in the car when we go somewhere. :(  Thats not fair to her..
Any advice there?
I dont think he would like ear muffs, which was my only idea so far..



[/QUOTE]

What exactly does he do when she talks in the car? 

Here's my opinion and it is JUST THAT...an opinion. 

I would no longer let him have control over this one. He has to at some time in his life get used to his sisters voice....even if it is sensory in nature.  It's not fair to her that she has  to comply with the same things that we do to just keep the peace.  We have all done it...I am not judging.  I have simular issues with Adam and his little brother touching his things.  I worry probably like you do what effect all this has on their siblings..you know? 

That being said...here are my suggestions:

1.  let him scream and ignore it.

2.  When he gets in her space to close her mouth or cover it...physically remove him and firmly tell him No.

3.  Like others have told me on here...If you have to remove yourself and your daugher from the room or even put him somewhere safe then that's ok too.

Hope things get better....I have no advice about the computer..sorry.

Karrie

 

 

Well..
Its only been going on for the past couple months so I dont think its really her voice, but for some other reason.
In the van it starts soon as Kaitlyn starts talking about something. He covers his ears and starts screaming. Its not a typical scream..when he does what I'm calling screaming he's pretty much saying AHHHHHHHHHH as loud as he can to cover her voice.  Then if she doesn't stop he starts bouncing in the seat and he shakes the entire van while doing this! Then he will start kicking the seat in front of him where she is sitting. I looked in the rear view yesterday and saw his shoe on top of her car seat.  I couldn't help but laugh.  After so much frustration and confusion sometimes you do just need to laugh.  But I guess he was trying to kick her in the head as a last effort of hushing her up, but he couldn't reach.  I had to move my infants car seat because William was sitting directly behind him and when Kaitlyn started talking William would start kicking and he was kicking the babies car seat.
I did at first try to make him stop touching her by taking his arm and telling him no, but then he would sit down and start crying and the tears would get to me.
I could tell the way he looked at me that he was upset because I didn't understand the problem and he looked so hurt. I can only imagine how hard it would be to not be able to communicate to me his feelings at all.
So I've explained to Kaitlyn that we can talk when we get to where we're going rather than in the van. And shes fine with that until this can be resolved.
William is very well behaved and does what he's told when he understands whats being ask of him so I know this is a matter that needs to be addressed a little differently than just correcting him. 
I'm going to try positive rewards for him when shes speaking to see if I can reverse this.

Well.. this is tough. He LOVES the computer. The first thing he wants to do when he gets up in the morning is to get on the computer and he cries when he has to leave it for school. He screams constantly at school when the teachers try to make him interact and sit down to do his work because there is a computer in the room and he wants to be on it.  Then when we come home from school I dont even get everything in the door and he's already at the computer again.
When he gets frustrated and starts screaming at the computer I make him sit down, but then he starts crying like I've hurt his feelings. :(
So I'm completely confused on that..  He does get worse if I try to fix what I "think" is bothering him though.  He can't tell me so I guess he gets really upset.
We do the guessing thing when he's hungry and he doesn't mind telling me no..no..no..yeah, but on the computer he has no patience with me.  The computer is a BIG part of Williams life. He seems to be obsessed with it and I think its because he feels that it is his main way of communicating or maybe being "normal".  He types numbers, prime numbers, the alphabet forwards and backwards, words (usually animals and sounds) and of course plays his games that he loves. When people come over and see how well he handles the computer he gets lots of praise and attention so I think that makes him like it even more.
Maybe I can find something to redirect his attention when the computer upsets him. Or just take him to his room and let him have some quiet time or something.
But I feel like his computer routine would continue anyway since he is learning new games and that is where the frustration comes in. Once he conquers the game he's fine and moves on to another frustrating learning experience with a new game.
My main concern with William right now is how he reacts when his sister speaks.
Kaitlyn is 5 years old and anytime she tries to talk to me around William he gets VERY upset. He screams and covers his ears and if she doesn't stop he marches over and tries to stick his elbow in her mouth or cover her mouth with his hand.
I can't tell if he's jealous of her being able to talk so well or if her voice just irritates him for some reason.  I have seen him get upset with another little girl, but its usually just Kaitlyn.  I feel so bad telling her no talking in the car when we go somewhere. :(  Thats not fair to her..
Any advice there?
I dont think he would like ear muffs, which was my only idea so far..



wow..So I've been labeling my sons behavior as tantrums and fit pitching when its really called a meltdown. That word sounds so much more professional and less bratty. I need to start using that one instead. Thank you so much for that article!!!

Norway Mom has it pretty much covered. I could say my piece but it has mostly been summed up already.

Your best bet is to try to identify the triggers and avoid them. But if a meltdown does occur the best thing to do is remove him from the situation, allow him to calm down, and definitely be supportive. Don't make him feel like he's overreacting because you may not actually realize what he's reacting to, and he may not be able to tell you. Assuming you know the problem and trying to "fix" it on the spot may actually make things more frustrating for him because he is trying (unsuccessfully) to process an overwhelming amount of input, hence the panic. So "fixing" the apparent problem actually qualifies as further input and thus may infuriate him even more because if you are wrong, it will be clear to him that you do not understand his plight and he will become even more panicked as a result. So bottom line, let him calm down before you go making extra accomodations.

Try to keep the "drama" level to a minimum, and do your best to prepare him in advance for changes in his schedule or environment. These changes will be accepted more easily by a person with autism when he can anticipate and prepare for them.stickboy2639310.7910648148tell me where I can get a copy of this. Everytime I try to copy something from here it never comes out right so please tell me ...this article was great and I thought I could pass it on to Justin's siblings.

A child with an ASD may display challenging behaviour at times. Challenging behaviour in an educational context can be described as any behaviour that interrupts the flow of a lesson, or challenges the authority of the teacher trying to teach a specific task. Challenging behaviour can range from silence when a question is asked, to repetitive tapping of a pencil. The range of challenging behaviour that a child with an ASD could exhibit is quite wide, ranging from silence to excessive talking or echolalia to sensory shut down. Other types of challenging behaviour are of a physical nature such as biting, spitting, hitting and kicking, self harm, or throwing of objects.

Neuro-typical individuals use communication to create and maintain friendships - being the opposite of challenging behaviour and an integral survival skill to reproduce and maintain the species. Autistic individuals do not desire friendships in the same way, only to meet their personal needs. Autistic individuals can have sexual drives, however with a lack of social, physical and personal understanding, they can exhibit this drive in a variety of socially inappropriate ways. Restricted communication desire, ability and skills lead to a self imposed limiting cycle. Inappropriate behavioural issues can then manifest as a result of frustration and lack of methods to express their requests.

Individuals with less severe autism,may have a much harder experience of life. They are aware that they are different because of their special interests. Some people with an ASD are aware that society can find their behaviour challenging by the way that people interact with them; however, they are unable to relate or empathise with others. Their lack of imagination restricts their ability to work out what others are feeling and communication difficulties lead them to take communication literally, as they miss intonation of voice, body language and sub text within a conversation. The ability to only mono task, allowing just one element at a time to be processed may limit them as neuro-typical people multi task as a matter of course.

Spinning and repetitive behaviours can be misinterpreted as being disruptive in individuals with an ASD. These can be the result of the individual shutting out all other sounds and thoughts, providing calm from their disorganised world. Challenging behaviour can be a result of several areas impacting on each other, limited communication can be a factor. Sensory issues involving touch, hearing, sight, taste, vestibular and proprioceptive input or smell may be uncomfortable for individuals. Auditory processing, social-emotional characteristics involving anxiety, low tolerance, fears or anger can cause challenging behaviour. A short attention span and the organisation of the environment may also cause issues that may need investigating when solving challenging behaviour problems. 

Any of these variables can contribute to an escalation or de-escalation of the undesired behaviour. The key is to know the child. Some of the time it is possible to predict the type of behaviour that is just about to arise by “reading” the child and working out what sort of mood they are in. Changing any of these parameters will obviously have an effect on the other children so I need to bear this in mind when I am arranging classroom support assistants, myself and the children in my class.

Some behaviour can be predicted by the time of the week, as some children find Monday mornings difficult as they generally are not able to remember the weekly calendar and are shocked that the routine of the weekend has not continued into Monday, they are surprised weekly that it is a school day. The change of routine for some children can be problematic. The start of term can be difficult for some children who will have been following different routines at home where they may have been less challenged to mix and share with others.

spectrummum39310.640474537

hi its on my group

its a message board for my members

so id ont know

you are welcome to copy it though

Thanks yes my parents do but I am kinda more experinced for my age I am a senior and graduating the winter to go onto college so I just like to know what is going on.
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