Off the Phone with the Teacher | Autism PDD

There is a difference between social and "socially motivated", which some kids on the spectrum are. I used to think than my son cannot be on the spectrum because he was social, until I got him "officially" diagnosed and the child psychologist told me that he is "socially motivated" which means that he likes being around people and might go up to kids and "blab", but what next?? Can he "interact" ?? Can he carry on a conversation?? Can he share joy ??? Social has nothing to do with being on the spectrum..That must be very frustrating. Maybe you could get a dx from a dev. ped.? I dont think school dx outweight any medical professionals dx. Also I agree it totally depends on the teacher/person. I have been around many kids on the spectrum and some were very social..would greet me.. hug me and want me to hold their hand but still unable to have a conversation with me. Sarah's teacher had the worst scenerio of having a asd child in her classroom and Sarah didnt do any of the things she read about so she completely was in denial that anything was wrong with my child..but when I asked her if Sarah talked to kids, initiated conversation or stayed with her peers on playground she stated no..not really.  I still am educating her teachers on getting expressive language and social skills out of Sarah..she doesnt stim or behaviors so she easily is in a position to be ignored..she is very quiet.  A dev. ped is the best person to evaluate asd kids especially if they are on the higher end of the spectrum. Ours knew exactly what to look for and although Sarah had good verbal skills, and eye contact~her expressive language is not up to par as peers. 

My son is very social.  No one could ever deny that.  Though his social skills are definitely delayed and I would not describe them as age appropriate.  If my son were behaving as he does today, but was 4 years old instead of 6 years old, no one would probably question his social skills.  The intent is there, and the execution is there to a degree, but there is a definite difference in the maturity of C's social skills compared to his NT twin.

I would get the opinion of a dev-ped or neuropsych and bring that report to your IEP.

Each teacher may be different as well.  Last year my son's teacher's tried to tell me he wasn't austistic...just really adhd.  The even did the test (CHAT?) and had me do it too.  Their's showed up in non autistic range but mine showed up in the mild/moderate range.  Anyway, this year he has new teachers, he has grown leaps and bounds and his language has improved but he is clearly austistic.  His teacher's agree this year.  Being social doesn't mean that you can't be austistic...at least not in my experience.  My son is social and smiles all the time but there are other things that put him in spectrum.  Bottom line is only the doctor's should diagnosis autism.The school my son goes to denies he is on the spectrum. Most of the kids they have who are ASD are moderate to severe. There are those few who are mainstreamed well---but are your "typical" aspergers type. My son is not. He will only appear ASD when they do "new" things--but his teacher said he is getting better. And of course---when people aren't following the "rules". Easy to get frustrated---but so much better than when young. Behavior is a big one also. Needs "alone" time but can't express it, except by acting out. We are very lucky to have a teacher with personal experience with her own son!I have to say my son is extremely social but is most definetly on the spectrum.  I believe his teacher feels the same way because he is social but I think she also understands that it is still autism and after six dr.'s confirming I am not about to change that.  It is interesting that she thinks that.  Are they talking about integrating into a regular classroom or anything to help with his social and language skills? That would be something I would look at my ds is in an all inclusive autism class but would love to see him integrated at some point.  My son is extremely social, he tries to engage everyone.   He is autistic and
he has a medical dx. At this point, I think that most of us Moms are good at
spotting Asd Kids. We however can not and would not diagnose children.
The teacher may have an opinion, but it is her opinion thats it.
What your son and my son has are pervasive developemental delays. These
delays need to be addressed for them to make progress. If it helps to get
the dx, she should not get in the way. I'm sorry that you're scared. I have to say that school has always told me that Zach was social and he is but just not appropriately, it is sometimes subtle but it's definitely there. It really is hard when people express doubts and then you doubt yourself. It's also hard at that age to see especially if it is subtle.

I just don't see how a teacher could be a deciding person on what educational diagnois your son gets.  Honestly why is she even commenting on this? Even if she specializes in Special education SO WHAT...she's not a doctor. "I'm sorry _____ but I don't feel comfortable with my son's educational diagnosis being influenced or decided on by someone that is not a doctor."   That is exactly what I would say to them (in a nice voice :) ) If they try and use her opinion to not give you what you want. 

Karrie

I am extremely scared now after getting off the phone with D's teacher. She said that she doesn't think he's on the spectrum. She says that she knows she's not a doctor, so they really have the final say, but she feels he's far too social to be ASD.

I do sometimes have my doubts, but that's not what scares me about this. We are attempting to get D's label changed to Autism from Developmental Delay (she is not aware of this yet as we were going to bring it up at next week's IEP meeting). If his teacher doesn't believe he's on the spectrum, that says to me there is next to no chance we will get his label changed.

Also, what if she's right? She feels he's too social, to the point of initiating conversation. I get that if he's on the spectrum, it's really hard to see his social issues until he gets the language to back it up. She feels that it might be a language delay with some sensory issues. She says he's social in class and has yet to see any stimming except when he's copying someone else's stim.

We are working on a second opinion, but I just had to get this out. I'm very very frightened by this comment. (It was unofficial. I was just calling to find out where D's change of underwear disappeared to.)

Here's my take. In Minnesota, a child needs to get an educational diagnosis from the school in order to qualify for services. They do not need to take a medical diagnosis into consideration at all. If things go to due process, a medical diagnosis is given consideration, but most parents don't take things that far.

I would be worried if my ds' teacher told me she didn't think he had autism as she has a lot of influence on the IEP meeting - even though she is his mainstream teacher. All members of the IEP team get to have input. They need to do all sorts of testing, though, in order to deny him services. If the testing confirms the autism diagnosis, that is given a lot of weight. However, if they feel that his issues are not interfering with his EDUCATION, they can deny him services. They tried this with my son (his old school that is!) and I fought them every step of the way. I won. I got my son a medical diagnosis and the  dev ped wrote them a scathing letter. Ds scored in the autism range (not just the ASD range) on the ADOS and had clear deficits in fine motor skills. Observations in the classroom also noted that he never socialized with peers. There were other things although I can't remember off-hand. ANYWAY, I don't remember what state you are from, Melody, but if you are living in Minnesota, I understand why you are nervous.

They have to do extensive testing in order to say he does or does not have autism. You can request an eval, or if that has already been done - you can request an Independent Educational Evaluation to be done by someone else that you trust (and is on the list provided by the school). Don't let them tell you that your son doesn't have autism without doing extensive testing first. If you have a medical diagnosis, that can help your case.

Good luck on this and keep us posted!

By the way, my ds was very interested in being social - socially motivated, I guess! Now, he is very social - but he is still definitely on the spectrum. I think it's great that he is interested in interacting - my ds was not so interested at your son's age.

My son is social, maybe not appropriately all the time but he will greet people and participate in things if he wants to.

The teacher is obviously not an expert on autism spectrum.  I have been known to politely ask if a person is specialized that that area and that I'd like to know more if they have more info.  Usually shuts them up.  pretty quick!!

Just listen to the pros and get documentation and shove it under her nose.  Or find something on the net on educating kids with autism.  I found one on bipolar when we were working with that diagnosis and it helped them immensely.  Although, imho they should be educating themselves the second they get a child with any special need in their class, but hey, that's just me.

 

We do have an official medical diagnosis from a neurologist. We're on waiting lists for a developmental, but even the private ones are several month wait to even get an appt. So for now, we're going on what we have and could get. The state guidelines for autism say they only consider a medical diagnosis, but that children have to meet specific things to get an educational diagnosis. He definitely doesn't meet the "social" part as many of them are not measurable because of his age and communication delay.

The teacher told me what she's seeing. She said that he is saying hi to whomever comes to him, by name. If they are sitting down beside him, he plays along with them as well. He, and the others in the class, really don't have the speech to judge anything past what they see.

His teacher is also a BCABA and sets up all the children's ABA program in her class. The majority (minus I think 1 child) of her class is ASD. She's been teaching for several years. I say this because it seems to me that the school will feel she's more than qualified to determine whether he meets educational autism standards over myself.
My son is - and always has been- social, initites conversations, initiates
play, is physically affectionate and does not stim in ways that stand out
socially. He clearly is on the spectrum and has problems in school that
are pretty typical for spectrum kids. Autism looks so different in nny kid
that it is hard to see that my son might have the same thing that a kid
who does not socially initiate and stims a lot, has. I would thank the
teacher for her input and leave the dx up to a specialist.I would also be
careful to have the school tell you that your son is less impaired than his
dx says because it usually goes hand in hand with less service and an
attitude that asd behaviors are just due to the kid being rude.I have found that teachers, although most are well intentioned...really aren't the greatest authority on whether a child is Autistic or not. My son Jesse was dx when he was 2 with Autism. He began using Echoing by age 2 1/2 yrs. He was in Early on with lots of therapy. He went to PPI and they brought in their own team to evaluate Jesse when he was 4 and they informed me that he wasn't Autistic.

At that time I was pretty alone, I love my husband but he was worthless when it came to advocating for the kids. They said because he was showing so much progress..began to have 3 word sentences didn't matter that he was often repeating the question back. They just felt he wasn't Autistic, they kept his Speech and Language label instead. 2 mos later we moved to a new district and instead of fighting the system I let them continue that label and the new school gave him OT, which the old school refused to do.

Flash forward to a year ago and he was 10...another NEW school. Jesse was getting discharged from the Speech and they were considering OHI...which is Otherwise Health Impaired (ADD) and the School social worker called me and asked if anyone ever suggested that Jesse was really Autistic? I told her he was dx at the age of 2 but the school refused the label and I stopped fighting for the label. I was told back then to force the label would be harming Jesse more than helping.

She asked permission to start over with assessments and I went to the Psych who did her own tests and we all came up with the same dx...which is High functioning Autistic. The very first school insisted he was just Delayed...baloney!

His services haven't changed with the correct label BUT it gives his teachers better insight into Jesse and his quirks.

The unfortunate thing about schools is they don't have to accept the dx from a Dr., we had 3 different opinions back then and they refused to accept it. If you think the Dr.'s are right...keep fighting for him. Education on Autism is so evolving and even Spec. Ed teachers who are certified in AI are constantly learning that not every child is a "classic" Autistic kid.

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