Is echolalia a speech delay -DSM? | Autism PDD

I tend to agree with Nick that HFA and Asperger's are close, especially the older the child is. My son was diagnosed "autistic disorder" at 2.10 but now everyone calls him Asperger's. It actually kind of bugs me, they are even putting it on school stuff. When they did the 3 year re-eval 2 years ago, that is what the school put on the papers. He didn't speak until he was 4 and just doesn't really "fit" asperger's to me.

My son had echolalia after 3, but began to use some receptive speech. He worked very hard on reciprocal speech in preschool. He STILL, at almost 7, will make the choice he wants as the last thing you say. If you say "Gage, do you want hot dogs or chicken?" He will say chicken. So then you say, "Gage, chicken or hot dogs?" He will say hot dogs. No matter what you choice you offer him, "Do you want to watch Flubber or Star Wars?" He will say the last thing - Star Wars. "Stars or Flubber?" He will say Flubber.
Anyway, I just really think in my heart that he does not have Asperger Syndrome. He has never fit in with Asperger Syndrome. He also has a ton of empathy & emotional responses, so not sure. He has only had one specialist call it Aspergers (the Psychologist), everyone else (Ped, Neoro, ect)have said PDD-NOS. I am going to get another eval done.[quote]In Valerie Paradiz's book "Elijah's Cup" (see my N*zi Germany thread), she says that if your child speaks in echolalia it is considered high functioning Autism & NOT Aspergers.
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I think HFA and Asperger's are very close on the spectrum -- in some cases there is hardly enough of a difference to tell one from the other.

I would think that echolalia is not a speech delay but rather a delay in pragmatics and language usage. By the time I was 3 I was echolalic to the point of reciting entire books and poems. I was considered very advanced in my speech and language skills despite the fact that I couldn't interact with my peers with any great deal of success until I was in high school. I know what echolalia is, and sometimes I might have a patient with it, but they generally repeat every word.  You guys are great. Can somebody give me a few examples of a child who uses it sometimes might sound like.  For instance as mentioned in this thread a child repeating the last word said.  My son does that.   I've been wondering if that might explain some of my ds's speech that seems inappropriate, but he doesn't mean it that way. My 3 1/2 year old does have spontaneuous speech, but he also does some immediate and delayed echolalia.  One example is that sometimes if you ask, "Do you want to drink chocolate milk," he will answer with, "Chocolate milk."  He won't repeat entire phrases as immediate echolalia, but he will sometimes say the last thing.  I would say that right now 1/2 my son's speech is spontaneous.  The rest is some form of echolalia.

eta:  I do think it is considered a delay at a certain age.  For example, at my son's age he should be answering yes or no questions consistently rather than repeating the word when his answer is "yes".  (He will say no if the answer is no.  Yes is the biggie we are working on.
kdchaos39373.7448842593I would like to add that my NT daughter did not appear to ever go through a stage in which she used echolalia. Like, at all. I never recall her doing this. She never once repeated me or repeated a commercial on TV or anything. Either she, for one reason or another, bypassed that stage completely or her echolalia was so slight compared to my DS's that I did not notice. To me, she seemed to speak in receptive language & use language very well right away, even as a baby.Good question, My son is an Aspie and has delayed echolalia , but it did not start until he about 3 or 4 years old. We never experienced echolalia, only delayed echolalia. And all of it is long dialog, he might have heard weeks or years ago. Interesting subject.  

It's actually a normal stage in language development (not all kids go through it, but some do), but typical kids pass through the stage at a very young age (i.e. as babies/toddlers).  The presence of echolalia in older kids indicates immature language development, so, yes, language delay.  The criteria for diagnosis for Asperger's syndrome are communicative phrases at 3.0 at a minimum, so if the language was pure echolalia without any meaninful, spontaneous phrases, then I would think an Autistic diagnosis would be warranted vs. an Asperger's syndrome diagnosis - but I'm no diagnostician and it'd just be splitting hairs, anyways - imo these conditons are pretty much the same.

According to this milestone chart, echolalia usually diminishes by 2.5:

http://www.aafp.org/afp/990600ap/3121.html

fred39373.0603587963I don't get it.
My son spoke basically nothing but echalalia at least until age 3. Doesn't that count as a speech delay?
In Valerie Paradiz's book "Elijah's Cup" (see my N*zi Germany thread), she says that if your child speaks in echolalia it is considered high functioning Autism & NOT Aspergers.
Once again, I don't think my son has Aspergers. He has gotten both a PDD-NOS dx and an Aspergers dx. But Aspergers has never "sat right" with me, as he does not display a lot of Aspie features.
So is echolalia considered a speech delay or not? Anyone know?

Here's an idea for those of you whose child echoes back the last choice (modified from PECS protocol).  Offer 2 choices, one being a preferred item (ex. M&Ms) and one being nonpreferred (ex. asparagus).  Offer the nonpreferred last (do you want M&Ms or asparagus?).  If kiddo responds asaparagus, that's what they get.  When they look surprised - ask again.  Eventually, they should tune in to the entire question and be a little more discriminatory.  It helps to have the visual choices there at first.  Good luck!

Hope - I think the scripting type of echolalia isn't as common as the imeediate echolalia.  My son went through an echolaliac phase as he was becoming aware of the 'back and forth' nature of conversation - he would generally repeat what he heard other people say to him as a means of conversing "back and forth".  IIRC - he was about 1-2 or so when he was doing this.  Neither of the girls had an echolaliac phase, interestingly, though they do have an odd idiosynchrasy that's like scripting - not sure what you'd call it - but they have phrases that they use in a rote manner - appropriately, but they use whole phrases as if they were single words which makes some of their sentences sound awkward.  hard to explain - you'd have to hear it. fred39373.8206828704My son use to have echolalia , its been almost a year now he doesnt repeat anything. I believe with speech therapy it can go away.

Doodersma:

That's a great idea!  My son just repeats the last thing you say.  If I ask him if he's a boy or a girl- he'll say girl.  I'll switch it and ask if he's a girl or a boy and he'll say boy.  Ugh! 

My son is almost 3.5 yrs old.  He does some echoing too, but lately it is almost nonexistant.  We have been told to "keep and eye on him."  He is currently in OT/Speech once a week for an hour.  He has also started preschool and has been doing that and his therapies for about a month.  We have seen alot of progress, but I dont know yet if he falls on the spectrum.  The SLP thinks he is going through something of a language growth spurt right now and that once he processes it and gets it figured out, We should see less and less echoing, which we definitely have but I dont know if I should be more concerned about him being on the spectrum.  He has somewhat low muscle tone which is why he is in OT.  He does have good eye contact and is CONSTANTLY engaging us in conversation, there is just difficulty with keeping the conversation totally going and expanding.  He is really a statement talker and does ask questions.  He just started using alot of "where" questions.  I am hoping the "why" ones will start soon.  But other than my worries and concerns, I cant complain about him.  He is very very loving and I have people tell me how well behaved he is.  I guess time will tell if he is on the spectrum.  Has anyone else had a similar experience?I've often wondered the same thing about pdd-nos and aspergers.  My son has the pdd-nos dx but even the dev ped said that might change in the future to aspergers.  The only speech delay my son has is pragmatics.  He did use scripting in his language but it is almost always appropriate.  He sometimes says the wrong thing when he is trying to learn a response for a situation.  He somtimes scripts an interesting phrase that he hears our teenage son say when he is trying to figure out what it means.  I think that people have a different opinion of aspergers and think it is very hf so it is probably a better label in some ways.
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