Yuck on the potato milk. We tried that just last week and BB and I both hated it!
Rice milk RULES
Their favorite, still, by far, is cow's milk, though!
DW likes the Almond Milk. I dig the Rice milk when I use "milk." Great on cereal :)Kristy,
Glad C liked the soy milk, it's wonderful that he made the transition so easy. Cooper is just like C in that he has to have a cup... it doesn't have to be a certain one and he's really happy if he has 2 at the time... he wants 2 of everything...
Now, for my concern... I read on the TACA site (How to go GFCF in 10 weeks) that an "overuse" of soy is linked to erosion of the esophogus, stomach and upper intestine, kinda scared us to continue with the soy. What do you guys think? What would be considered an "overuse"??? Anyone know anything about this?
Also, mom2ashkay, where do you get the rice milk and how expensive is it? I found some recipes for rice milk on the internet, made some and tried Cooper on it... HE DIDN'T LIKE IT! He was so happy to get his cow's milk back!
ShellyR, didn't see your post before I posted... where do you get the potato milk and how expensive is it? I'm just trying to look at all the options. Thanks!
** Sarah's milk intake went from 8 bottles a day to @ 3 a day just fine once we switched...her awareness was the biggest improvement:)
BB does not know the difference and has not had milk. We went from breast-feeding to rice milk. Soy is very difficult to digest.
So, in this, it is difficult to say how long it took, but...when we have given him yogurt we have seen his tummy act up (probably the probiotic nature of it) and some behavioral issues as well. Found a rice based yogurt substitute. It is very good :)
When I took dairy out of my daughters diet over 3 years ago she hated soy couldn't get her to drink it. She even spit it out on the kitchen floor. Then I tried Rice Milk. She at first didn't drink it but would have cereal with rice milk and then over time she started drinking it. By the way at the time she lived on chocolate milk! I couldn't go anywhere without a thermos full of it and a container of quick in my bag. Now it's strawberry milk thanks to Charlie and Lola(It's a pink milk marathon) that's when she started drinking milk again! So Mishy you might want to try Rice milk. As for when I could tell a difference I would say it was a couple of days she was calmer. Her dad came home that night that we went dairy free and said that he could tell a difference but we both admitted that it might have been that we wanted to see a difference. I can still tell when she has some at school but she doesn't react as severely now mostly tells me she has a tummy ache. Keep us updated! I am very curious to see how this works out. Although, Anthony rarely drinks milk. He does like cheese and drinks oj w/ calcium added.The potato milk is Vances Dari-Free milk and it tastes pretty good. A lot ofWe did the Vances' potato milk..it comes in quart dry mix like a qt of milk...you can make a few gallons I think from it...it came in handy for restaurants and relatives homes because I could just add water wherever we went.. A little pricey but she didnt drink much so it last quite a while..it is totally fortified with all the calcium, vit. A&D just like reg milk. We got it a healthfood store by us that is owned by a mom that has an autistic son so she also carries lots of kirkman products too.
I agree with the rice milk personally. I have a 5 yr old ASD & 18 month typical child. I am along with both of my boys allergic to dairy. Neither of my kids like rice milk, they prefer the vanilla soy. If I give them original soy they won't drink much. I notice anything dietary that disagrees with Christian (my 5 year old) will make all his ASD symptoms much worse.
NanaLuvsCooper I find rice milk in all of the stores around here (Dayton Oh) It doesn't have to be refrigerated until after it is opened so it is on the self, usually next to the evaporated milk. around here it runs about for 1/2 gal. If you have a Trader Joe's around you get it there it's cheaper than anywhere else that I have found. It is money well spent!!! I noticed it with both kids w/in 24 hours. But they definately made more progress as the weeks past w/o dairy. We have just switched to Soy today, but I am confused. Is there a difference between Soy and Rice Milk and is what recommended over the other?I have not completely taken cow's milk or dairy away from Daniel, I have just decreased it A LOT. I don't like the idea of restricting any food completly from his diet, unless there was an allergy. Anyways, he was drinking waaay more than the recommened amount of milk. Now he gets mainly soy milk in his cup and in his cereal. I still allow cheese though. I have seen a BIG difference. I will never know if it is just chance or not, but he is sooo much more aware and interactive with me now.
At the beggining of the summer, his scored severly delayed in all areas of speech. He was barely saying single words, and only a few. He is now useing phrases, on his own, that I do not have to intiate or prompt him to use. The echoing has decreased A LOT.
Lately, to help with his hyperness, I have started to replace other things. Danny would drink apple juice all day before if I let him. Now when he gets juice it is diluted. He can have all the fruit he wants, just not fruit juice all day long. Instead I buy gateraid and give him that in between meal times. C
arb filled snacks are also more moderated than before. I am basically just choosing healthier foods, and lowering sugars (and carbs like chips that turn into sugar quickly). He gets plenty to eat though! We have found other healthier alternatives to chips and juices (which are fine in moderation). Sliced apples, rasiens, even baked sweet potatoe fries (which are still better than cheese doodles and such, lol). When ever I do give him a cup of cows milk, I DO see a difference in him.. he is more whiney, and prone to more fits.
His Dev. Ped said it was like an entirely different kid when I brought him in last week, compared to when we went in June. they said he was more "typical" than "atypical" now, which was the complete opposite before.
This could be chance though. Danny has always had period of drastic regressions and progressions. I don't want to give anyone false hope. But what have you got to lose?
UPDATE:
We have replaced cow's milk (in his cup) with soy milk and rice milk, decided to use a combination since Cooper prefers the soy over the rice.
1st day: Cooper ate a really good dinner... actually I would compare it to "eating like a little pig"... better than I have ever seen him eat before: mashed potatoes, black-eye peas, corn, tostitos & m&m's.... lol
2nd day: Cooper talked more than I have ever heard him talk in a one day period... no new words, but more talkative and he seemed calmer, more focused and the eye contact seemed better. Usually we may get a word or two, sometimes a 3 word sentence, in the span of 1 day, but never more than that. Today he said 3 3-word sentences ("I go Dada", "I Love Dada" when Pa and I were talking with him about his Daddy; "I get it" when Pa asked him if he wanted his cup and was reaching for the refrigerator door... Cooper actually went in the refrigerator and got his own cup, so I know it was purposeful), he said "in" when he was helping me put clothes in the dryer. He signed and said "milk", we gave him more chocolate soy, not exactly what he had in mind, but he drank it. He said "go" to make us make the golf cart go, and he told us "bye" when his Daddy picked him up.
So far I am very encouraged. I sent soy and rice milk home with him... he went to his Daddy's this weekend, that's why all the talk about Daddy... we always talk to him about it when it's his weekend. I told my ex-SIL what we were doing and everything Coopeer had done and said so I'm sure he will continue to give him the soy and rice.
So far so good...
Some background. C has been OBSESSED with milk since he was a baby. We thought we'd never get him off the bottle. He was over 2 when we FINALLY got him to switch to a sippy cup, but it could only be a apecific Avent cup. Whenever C would get overstimulated, hurt, upset, tired, or get in the car, he would demand his "milk cup." It has been his only comfort item. When C used to have raging meltdowns 5x times per day a few years ago the ONLY way to get him to calm down was to give him the cup. Everywhere we go, we carry a cooler bag with the milk cup plus extra milk lest we have an incident when we're out and we need to calm him quickly. It's been that extreme - and a huge pain in the butt to lug milk everywhere we go. We averaged 2 -3 gallons of milk per week just for C.
So last Sunday C asks for milk and I give him a cup of soy. He drinks it, stops, looks at it, and says "tastes funny." I said "sorry, that's the milk we have." He then drank about half and abandoned it. He asked for milk a few more times and the same thing happened. Didn't get upset, didn't freak out, just said "can I have some gatorade?" He hasn't asked for milk in 2 days. He seems completely indifferent to the fact that his favorite drink (and favorite cup) are gone. BTW - all other beverages are consumed in regular glasses with ice. The only think he was drinking in the special "milk cup" was milk.
So now C drinks no milk. And I don't have to carry milk with me anymore. And he could care less. And I've seen absolutely no change in him. What the heck? This is incredibly bizarre. No one in my family believes me that C gave up the milk without a fight. Fight? Heck, he didn't even care! I feel like I'm in the twilight zone.
My 4 yr old was tested for casein peptides and his were very high, so we are GFCF...soy resembles casein in a similar way...in fact, when we tested, we had to be soy protein free for 5 days to make sure the results weren't skewed!!! My boys are Low Oxalate too and all the alternative milks are very high in oxalates...I give the boys calcium supps and they drink water and lemon juice instead!!! I use coconut milk when I need a dairy for recipes!!! It is so yummy!!!Well on Saturday I went out and bought some Soy Milk fortified with Omega 3 and on Sunday I just swapped it for C's regualar milk. He took a sip and said "milk is funny" and I said "sorry, that's the milk we have" and he said "ok" and walked away. He's been drinking it without complaint all day yesterday and today. He's not drinking as much as he was when it was cows milk, probably because he doesn't like it as much. To say the swap out went better than expected is understandment of the year. It was a complete non-event. This is from a kid who needs his "special milk cup" in the morning, at night, when he's in the car, when he's tired, when he's hurt, etc. Milk IS his comfort object. And I changed it and he didn't freak. I'm still finding this difficult to believe - but I'm certainly not complaining!
So, for those of you who eliminated dairy and saw a difference, how long did it take?
I noticed a difference in Brendon over time. It wasn't a "miracle" where he started saying words the next day or anything. I just noticed that his focus was better, he was saying a few more words, his sleep improved, his meltdowns became fewer. Lots of little things that really added up to me really. It's still slow going. I like to think that Jacob is maybe doing really well with ABA because I can honestly say that he has never had cow's milk in his life. He's also never had red dye or artificial sweetners. I took away the red dye and artificial sweetners from B at the same time as cow's milk. I don't know what caused the changes, but I wasn't going to start tinkering with something that he adjusted well to.I wish the change worked that easy for us. We bought soy milk this weekend and we even bought the chocolate kind no luck here. He took a couple sips and that was about it. I tried a couple times and nope no luck. He's little brother took the sippy cup and walked away with instead.
I dont even think it tastes that bad . It tastes like instant carnation breakfast to me :(
mom2ashkay, I found the rice milk right where you said it would be at our Winn Dixie here in town. We live in a very small town, 2 grocery stores and a very small Walmart... I was surprised and delighted to find it! It came in the quart size for .99 each. Thanks!
bonbon, I got the vanilla flavor... thanks for letting me know it's sweet. I only got one to try on Thursday when I pick Cooper up from Day Care. I sure hope he likes it. His Mama and I decided that since he already likes the Soy Milk, we will continue with that and try to work the Rice Milk in too.
Thanks Everybody for your suggestions!
This story happened a few years ago where I live.
http://www.heraldsun.news.com.au/common
/story_page/0,5478,4305451%255E2862,00.html
hmmm...link not working:-
here is the article:-
A tragic story from Melbourne, Australia...
From http://www.heraldsun.news.com.au/common
/story_page/0,5478,4305451%255E2862,00.html
Marcus and Ora Diskin were loving and adoring parents of their newborn daughter Eliana. But today they will appear in court charged with loving their child to death.
The Melbourne Magistrates' Court will be told Eliana was fed rice milk for the final 2 ½ months of her short life. The non-dairy milk alternative will be central to the hearing that will decide whether the Geelong couple are to face trial in the Supreme Court for the manslaughter of Eliana by gross negligence.
Eliana was born on July 8, 2000. She died of malnutrition on December 26 that year. Her parents had tried for years to conceive their first and only child. After a month of breast feeding, Mrs Diskin started supplementing the breast feeding with rice milk. Mr Diskin, a 44-year-old chiropractor, and his wife, 39, are both adherents to forms of alternative medicine. This is also expected to come under close scrutiny in court.
After three months, Mrs Diskin ceased breast feeding and Eliana was fed exclusively rice milk. The couple had concerns about preservatives and potential allergies arising from cows' milk and Eliana had earlier rejected soy milk.
After her three month check-up in October, Eliana was described as a happy child with her weight, health and development all appearing normal. The parents were told to return for a six-month check-up in January.
In the 2 ½ months leading up to Eliana's death, her parents became concerned about her nappy rash. They consulted traditional doctors, a naturopath and a kinesiologist and on December 12, a dermatologist. Four days later, with Eliana in obvious pain, her parents took her to Geelong hospital. She was transferred to the Royal Children's hospital where she later died. The cause of death was listed as disseminated invasive candidiasis, a form of thrush, caused by malnutrition.
Eliana's parents will be represented in court by leading Melbourne criminal barrister, Robert Richter, QC, and Mark Taft. The pair will argue the charges are unsustainable, partly on the basis that it was a case of misguided feeding, not neglect. The rice milk carton includes a statement that it is not to be used as infant formula. However, the statement, in fine print, is not preceded with either "warning" or "danger". The coroner may schedule an inquest on Eliana after court proceedings are finalised. But today a magistrate will start hearing evidence to decide whether the couple should stand trial. The hearing, in which 27 witnesses are scheduled to be called, is expected to last a week.
COMMENT: This unhappy story highlights the fact that rice milk is not an acceptable primary food for babies and, in my opinion, children. The article does not state why the mother stopped breast feeding her daughter. One can only assume it was because of lack of breast milk--a more common occurrence than La Leche League would have expectant and nursing mothers believe.
[QUOTE=mom2ashkay]NanaLuvsCooper I find rice milk in all of the stores around here (Dayton Oh) It doesn't have to be refrigerated until after it is opened so it is on the self, usually next to the evaporated milk. around here it runs about for 1/2 gal. If you have a Trader Joe's around you get it there it's cheaper than anywhere else that I have found. It is money well spent!!! [/QUOTE]
Thank you! I'll have to look closer, I've never seen it in any stores around here. Of course I wasn't looking....
from:
Diet and behavior in young children with autism
Principal Investigator: Hyman; site: University of Rochester
A gluten-free casein-free (GFCF) diet is one of the most popular interventions for autism. In our area, about 50% of families with preschool children with ASDs use this diet, despite the absence of evidence for its clinical effects or safety. We have preliminary evidence that many children with autism are at nutritional risk because of their self-imposed dietary restrictions, and that imposition of the diet may result in greater risk. Thus, it is critical to determine whether the GFCF diet has beneficial effects on some patients and to develop criteria for identification of children whose behavior may improve with dietary intervention. We propose a challenge study in which all subjects will be on a strict GFCF diet and all will be receiving the same intensity of behavioral intervention. This study will determine the phenotypic chacteristics of children who respond to dietary intervention and the nature of the response. All participants will be tested for a set of suspected genetic risk factors for ASDs to determine whether any of these are related to response to treatment. Several candidate genes for ASD susceptibility are expressed in the developing gut as well as the developing brain. These include HOXA1 and GBX2. Our hypothesis is that susceptibility genes that play a role in development of the gut are the ones most likely to play a role in response to dietary intervention.
Specific Aims:
The treatment team and the parents will collect data for three types of outcomes before and after these challenges:
Thanks Fred, sounds very interesting. I will bookmark that link and review it later.
Thank you for the story on the baby that died. It's a good reminder that balance in all things is good.
I do not take from this story that any kind of milk is bad though. I don't know what is taught or practiced in other countries but everything I've been taught, everything I've read & everything my doctors told me, I know that my baby under 1 if not being breast fed should have formula. Not cows milk, not soy milk, not rice milk but formula. There are formulas derived from all kinds of sources now so it doesn't have to be dairy. Babies under 1 are just learning how to eat, their main source of nutrition comes from breast or bottle, so that bottle can't be something other than that which is meant for the total dietary nutrition of a baby. After a year milk supplements their food diet so just make sure what ever milk you choose has the nutrition for that which milk should play in any diet.
This poor baby was 5 months old when she died. The last 2 1/2 months she was given rice milk. 99% of parents would never mean to harm their children, so I feel terrible for the parents that they either weren't very well informed or didn't listen to the advice doctors have been giving for ages. I'm not totally 100% pro for doctors, but they do know a lot. Take their advice with a grain of salt & do what is best for your baby, but certain things shouldn't be negated from the advice of a doctor.
Try almond milk. It is found in the organic section on the shelf (not cooler) in a large juice-box type carton. We switched my son who was having multiple ear infections, from cow's milk to almond milk.The family in thearticle are at the extreme end - but they are very educated people who fell through the cracks in the health system. The mother herself was allergic to milk and only drank Rice milk and therefore she assumed her daughter was the same. I cant remeber the brand of the rice milk but she imported it from the U.S (she was a U.S citizen herself). Its irrelevant anyway - it is just a very sad case of a baby dying. Just thought it was worth posting incase someone was relying on milk (whatever kind) as the only source of nourishment.
The maternal health nurse also came under fire during that inquest because she herself did not understand that rice milk was not 'milk'.
The couple were found guilty of manslaughter - but did not serve jail time. They are unable to have any more children.
Very sad story.