onset always befor age three? | Autism PDD

[QUOTE=snoopywoman]

Sorry - I have to comment here and correct something:

PDD-NOS is NOT solely a diagnosis for when it's later onset. It is a diagnosis for when a child does not fully meet the criteria for any of the other diagnoses under the PDD umbrella - either in number of symptoms or in severity. So, a child might have 5 of the 12 symptoms - but the doc feels that this warrants a PDD-NOS diagnosis (you need to have 6 symptoms for an autism or Asperger's diagnosis). Or, a child might have 7 symptoms but the symptoms aren't severe enough to warrant a full autism or Asperger's diagnosis. But since they are evident, the doc may feel strongly that the child should have a PDD-NOS diagnosis.

This is from childbrain.com that lists the criteria for each disorder. I've only listed the definition of PDD-NOS:

PDD NOS
This category should be used when there is a severe and pervasive impairment in the development of reciprocal social interaction or verbal and nonverbal communication skills or when stereotyped behavior, interests, and activities are present but the criteria are not met for a specific pervasive developmental disorder, schizophrenia, schizotypal personality disorder, or avoidant personality disorder. For example, this category includes "atypical autism" ? presentations that do not meet the criteria for autistic disorder because of late age at onset, atypical symptomatology, or subthreshold symptomatology, or all of these.

[/QUOTE]

I know PDD-nos is not only for late onset. It is for not meeting the complete criteria for autism or aspergers. And onset before 3 is one of the criteria. I was just mentioning it because that is what the orginal poster had said about late onset and not getting a dx. I also noticed that the child had the dx of PDD-nos already.

Sorry for all the confusion!

Sorry - I have to comment here and correct something:

This is from childbrain.com that lists the criteria for each disorder. I've only listed the definition of PDD-NOS:

PDD NOS
This category should be used when there is a severe and pervasive impairment in the development of reciprocal social interaction or verbal and nonverbal communication skills or when stereotyped behavior, interests, and activities are present but the criteria are not met for a specific pervasive developmental disorder, schizophrenia, schizotypal personality disorder, or avoidant personality disorder. For example, this category includes "atypical autism" ? presentations that do not meet the criteria for autistic disorder because of late age at onset, atypical symptomatology, or subthreshold symptomatology, or all of these.

For the original poster - it is hard to say. I think we worry about siblings a lot - I know I do! I mostly feel like it's a roller-coaster. One day, my dd will do something amazingly empathetic and that proves she has theory of mind. The next day she'll do something so bizarre or not "get" something (even though I explain it over and over) that I feel like she's got to be on the spectrum. Usually though, she understands far beyond her age. The dev ped said that he thinks she is just extremely bright and so she may have social issues because of that - because he felt she was definitely not on the spectrum (but he saw the social issues and a few quirks). I trust this guy because he evaluated my ds and has followed him for 2 years - so he knows the family history and he knows that we know what to look for. I was totally honest with him up-front. I told him I wanted him to see my dd because she had some quirks and was sounding out words (at age 2 1/2). I told him that in my heart, I really didn't think she was on the spectrum, but I was concerned about these issues and wanted him to check her out before we moved. He was totally fine with that - saw the quirks that I saw, was blown away by her sounding out words and said that he didn't see near enough symptoms to give her any diagnosis. He did not feel she was on the spectrum. My ds was very mild and he gave him a diagnosis when most people wouldn't have - so I trust him!

Anyway, long story short - if the person who diagnosed your older child is willing - maybe have him/her evaluate your dd. Just to see - unless, of course, it will cost you a fortune (we had a co-pay of so it was worth it!). I should say that I still worry - that hasn't gone away - but every time I do, I just remember what the doc said and that eases my mind some. In other words, I don't go into heart failure every time she asks the same question for the 8th time in 30 seconds (even though I've answered her each time!). This doesn't happen all that often - but enough that I momentarily panic when she does it.

Holly, can you explain what you mean? I got lost in the words and think I lost the meaning. Tried reading it over, but still getting lost.

As for the original topic, I think it's very typical of younger siblings of PDD kids to be naturally quirky. Some of it is just following the example of their siblings. Even to a certain extent, older siblings of PDD kids will have quirky things "rub off" on them. You just can't spend THAT much time around someone and NOT start taking on some of their characteristics.
My son got the diagnosis atypical autism (now called PDD-NOS in the US) because of the apparent lack of symptoms prior to age 3. Of course, this was partly because he was 6 at the time he was evaluated and we had to go by memory and old video tapes. Not responding to his name right away was really the only thing that stood out for me on the video tapes, also that he didn't really talk much when in new, stimulating situations.I see a lot of "quirkiness" in my daughter too...she is also 4...there are times where I wonder, but then she does something else that I think, no possible way...in all honesty, I think my DD gets a lot of her quirkiness from imitating her brother!I think most of the time, as we look back at the age of under 3y, we will find signs that we never caught. My son got it ruled out at 3.5y, but got the dx at 6y. He had the signs at 18 mo. Thats when his whole personality changed. At 2y---he never played prentend or with any of the toys. He would just dump them. Also---even though his language disorder wasn't found until 3.5y-----he had it before that. They only have to have "one" of the criteria delayed----all of this is only in Autism. For Aseprgers----it doesn't matter how old. And for PDD-NOS-----that's the dx for when it is a later onset.Even though my ds was not diagnosed until he was seven , in retrospect I
saw signs at 18 month.
I also have an almost 4 year old daughter that I have worried on and off
about for the last year. She has not regressed in any way really but in the
last year she just has seemed 'quirky' as in not quite typical. I have read
that an asd needs to be present before age three to be diagnosed - I
really saw nothing before age three. Does that mean she is just quirky or
maybe have something else like add.
Anyway - anyone who had a typically developing kid (who did not have a
reggression) later diagnosed with an asd?
P.S. I actually did read that in childhood disintegrative disorder a typically
developing kid can show a very significant regression between the ages
of 2 to 10. Now there is something to worry about at night.Kids with CDD lose major skills in a very alarming way. They do not appear
to be simply quirky, so I hope you can at least cross that off your list of
worries.

Agree w/ what MamaKat said about CDD. As far as your dd goes, she
may just be quirky. Or, there could be a possibility of Aspergers. From
what I am reading, most kids w/ asperger's don't get dx'd until well after
3, usually in the 5-7 age range, some not until their teens. Our older dd
is defenitely quirky, she also has issues w/ anxiety, OCD, & ADD...also GI
issues & a few other "PDD" signs, all of which were very soft signs early
on, but as she gets older seem to be more concerning. She was in 1/2
day kindergarten this past year, had a few issues, but nothing major. My
dd's psych said we'll just see how 1st grade goes. She said her
'quirkiness' & issues could escalate to warrant a full PDD eval, or they
could just continue as such and she'll just be one of those smart & quirky
kiddos.

So, I'd try not to worry too much. Just see how it all goes. For us, we'd
only seek out a diagnosis et al if our dd really needed the help/support
that a dx would get her in school. So far, she's not needed anything extra
than what we give her at home etc. I think Fred has put it best in one of
his recent posts about concerns for his son, how depending on how the
genes all get laid out, you may have autism or just a really quirky kid in
your family. Okay, he made more sense when he said it! Search his
posts...you'll find a lot of others here have or have had concerns for other
siblings. Take care...and don't lose sleep over CDD.

My son is 10 dx'd bi-polar mixed type at the age of 6, he was dx'd classic asd at 9. I didn't notice too much before the age of 5, but know that I learn about the illness and since most of the people hear have small kids I remember things when he was small. He hit all his milestones on time but there where other things like me and his dad having to rock him back and forth for at least an hour before he would sleep, or that he was an extremely calm child we never went through terrible 2's or teething. I just thought I was lucky, so he had the "not so typical" symptoms. So yes they can be dx'd without the onset before 3, at least that's what happened to my son.
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