IQ question | Autism PDD

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Dont have any knowledge but WOW your daughter sounds SUPER SMART

I have an IQ question, if anyone knows the answer to this, I'd appreciate it. When my dd was around two she started showing signs of what I thought was high intelligence. At two and one month she was able to draw a figure with eyes, nose mouth, arms and legs. Around 2.5 she was able to recognized that the same artist that did "Wallace & Gromit" did "Chicken Run". She was also able to do 100 piece puzzles with minimal assistance before turning three. At three and a few months I wrote down the first letter of her name and she wrote the other two letters next to it and can sight recognize a few words, not really reading.
 
Now that I'm learning about ASD I realize these are exactly the sort of things children with ASD excel in. In one of her evaluations she was given an IQ test and only scored 109, which didn't seem to fit with her abilities. Now I'm wondering if maybe it is just the ASD and not really a high IQ. I guess it doesn't matter but I'm disappointed because I know she has some problems with the ASD but I thought well at least she's very intelligent. Her language skills are just somewhat delayed but still in the normal range. She gets pronouns reversed but since we've been correcting her it has improved somewhat.
 
I guess I'm just hoping to hear something positive about her long term prognosis.
 
Thanks!
Three is a little young for IQ testing IMO. If she scored 109 already then I think she's a pretty smart girl. ASD kids can occasionally have higher than average IQ. I have consistently scored above 130 on IQ tests and I am on the spectrum. At age 5, and again at age 9, I tested at more than twice my age level at both reading comprehension and vocabulary.

She does sound super smart.  I can give you stories where Tuhina does too!  And, she IS ... in her way at her times.  And generally having to do with astute observation and concrete or abstract reasoning.

She scores 89 composite.  And last year, a different test, 86!  So ... I just ignore the scores.   The SD autism coach assured me IQ tests do NOT reveal potential!  She had to tell my DH 3 times in meetings, FORGET the IQ scores ... LOL.

HTH ...

3 is too young to gauge IQ accurately.  Also bear in mind for the future, that most ASD kids score much lower when tested using the standard WISC IQ test (Wechsler).  My son's IQ was similar to your daughter's when given the WISC (104, I think).  He was given a non-verbal IQ test when he was 9, and WOW!  What a difference!  He was given the Lieter IQ test, and scored a 136.  He moved from average intelligence to highly gifted, simply because the test was more appropriate for his processing abilities.  Food for thought Search IQ on this site and you'll have answers to keep you busy all afternoon!

My son scored much higher on hte verbal testing than nonverbal.  But overall, his IQ is still above average. 

Sounds like your daughter is very smart, but maybe too young for some of hte tests for them to be accurate.  If the test is repeated in a couple more years, the score may be higher.

I've tested around 160, 120, and 85 (in that order).  All I think it means is at one point in my life I (a) developed some abilities before most people do and (b) had a tester who was a bit old fashioned (she disregarded the parts I didn't do well at, so I can't even trust the score as what it is).  But they didn't continue to develop past that, they were just there already, early, and someone noticed.  Impressive in a 5-year-old, not impressive at all in a 22-year-old.  And I don't think the test means much of anything.  If it did, I'd think I'd get roughly the same score, and none of those are even in the ballpark of each other.  It seems like every time I take even the online tests I get a different score.
gtto39273.4507986111

Your daughter's early puzzle and reading skills are certainly a sign of intelligence.  The way her intelligence manifests itself is probably influenced by her autism, and she may have some of these common "autistic strengths"

<quote>

<unquote>

IQ test taking is not usually an "autistic strength."  My son was still basically untestable at age 7, let alone age 3.  I am very skeptical about IQ testing, since tests have led to the myth that "autistics are almost always retarded."  More on that topic here on our forum:

http://www.autism-pdd.net/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=12754&am p;KW=myth

You asked about prognosis.  I remember Fred had an article by an autism specialist who said it's impossible to predict the future, but that intelligence is definitely a factor in their favor.  I don't have time to search for the article today.

I also have this abstract, which says joint attention and imitating are signs of a good prognosis.  I added paragraph marks and notes to make it easier to read.

<Quote>

Joint attention abilities play a crucial role in the development of autism. Impairments in joint attention are among the earliest signs of the disorder and joint attention skills relate to outcome, both in the 'natural course' of autism and through being targeted in early intervention programmes.

In the current study, concurrent and longitudinal associations between joint attention and other social communication abilities measured in a sample of infants with autism and related pervasive developmental disorders at age 20 months, and language and symptom severity at age 42 months, were examined.

Extending the findings from previous studies, joint attention ability was positively associated with language gains and (lower) social and communication symptoms, and imitation ability was also positively associated with later language [Norway Mom's interpretation:  those who could imitate were more likely to acquire language, those who couldn't were more likely to be nonverbal]

Some specificity in the association between different aspects of joint attention behaviours and outcome was found: declarative, triadic gaze switching predicted language and symptom severity but imperative, dyadic eye contact behaviours did not.  [Norway Mom notes:  I'm assuming that diadic is between adult and child, triadic is between adult, child and object; declarative is for communication, imperative is "gimme".]

Further, although joint attention was associated with later social and language symptoms it was unrelated to repetitive and stereotyped symptoms, suggesting the latter may have a separate developmental trajectory.

Possible deficits in psychological and neurological processes that might underlie the impaired development of joint attention in autism are discussed.

<unquote>

Source:  http://www.journals.royalsoc.ac.uk/content/dh6qbh4k3cw76bnr/

Good luck with everything.

There are myriad tests out there that measure parts of IQ, and often the little kids get the Wechsler Preschool or the Woodcock Johnson.  And depending upon the day, how they tested, etc, performance may vary.

The important thing is to play to her strengths. If your child is only ho-hum in certain areas, get inventive and come up with ways to use her gifts to pull up the lower functioning areas.

Cole only scored a 109 at age 3, but then again, he refused to answer a full third of the questions.  His teachers were thrilled with this "basement" measurement and considered him highly gifted.

Then, at 6, they used a verbal test on a day he was just off in lala land, and he came out looking as if he were mentally retarded!  Yet, his reading is way above other kids his age and his rote memory will knock your socks off.

My point is - do NOT rely on these tests!  They delve right into the disability of autism (communication-wise) and there's no way to predict the outcome.

Oh, and on a personal note, I test like they oughtta make me design the next space shuttle mission, yet I don't have good sense enough to get out of the rain. My picture is in Wikipedia next to the definition for DITZ.  I think intelligence is a mosaic of abilities...and nobody's smart enough to come up with a test that measures the whole enchilada.

Think about a mechanic who flunked out of high school, yet he can rebuild your BMW in no time flat.  Is he smart or not? Blow this stuff off and focus on your kid.

LeAnne C39272.6027083333The cognitive test our dd was given by the SD gave her an IQ score of
145, which is considered very high-gifted. The test had her pointing to
pictures & then putting puzzles etc together. It was very visual & so she
did great. Her docs said she could take it another day, or another (less
visual) test & score compeletely differently. They also said at her age, IQ
can't really be measured accurately. At the same time, she does have
some very advanced (& uneven) skills which lead them to think she may
have savant abilities. I wouldn't put too much weight/focus on those test
results... Our dd, for example, has those advance skills (color, shapes,
now letters & numbers), but functionally would test MR. Her language &
communication, as well as behaviors, greatly shadow her intelligence
and/or "giftedness." I would just observe what you see--build on her
strengths & go from there, regardless of any test scores. To some extent,
prognosis is not determined by intelligence (search IQ on this forum for
that info too), especially when you start talking about very high IQs or
savant skills.
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