We continue to vaccinate both boys, even with flu shots. Its not just my kids getting sick I'm avoiding: mumps can leave other males sterile, types of measles can kill/blind someone else's fetus, chicken pox can give others shingles - a lifelong, painful herpes type ailment, chicken pox can give others encephalitis. The list goes on and on.
FYI, my 13 year old sister died from contracting chicken pox, which also had the encephalitis virus within it. Janice got chicken pox from me, and 3 days later, she was dead. I still cry for my strawberry-blonde sister.
People say: that'll never happen to us! Same thing they said before the autism diagnosis. You bet we vaccinate!
I also am pretty much done with vaccinations. You can always get a tetanus shot for your child if he or she gets hurt. My son had one last year when he split his lip on a metal chair. I figured at least it's only one shot -not 5 at a time. I really think that's an overload on a little one's immune system. Other than that no major illnesses here. Except my 4 yr old has PDD-NOS. While I realize this isn't fatal neither are most childhood illnesses. I am vaccinating my second son one at a time and he is not getting all of the vaccines since some are not necessary and more dangerous than others. Also, some of these vaccines don't even work. There was a big mumps outbreak in the midwest last year and most of the people affected had been vaccinated. Kind of makes you wonder.
Good luck,
Laurie
Anyone who doesn't want to vaccinate their children:Gtto - well said. The people who don't want to immunize probably have not had someone close to them be sidelined by one of these so-called "harmless" illnesses, and therefore, really don't regard them as threats.
As I wrote above, my 13 year old healthy sister died from chicken pox, so I know first hand what can happen. I can't imagine being immune-challenged and have to walk around Walmart wondering who is/is not carrying some devastating illness. As if the anxiety that sometimes comes with autism isn't enough!
Please do not interpret these folks as viewing death a better option than autism! I just am guessing that they think a rotten case of itchy measles is better than conjuring autsim in their kid. I do, however, wholeheartedly agree with your stance on immunizations. Me, my kids, and dearest hubby WON'T be getting others ill! Best of luck to your friend.
I just want to point out that vaccines are not perfect. I had the MMR 5 times and was still not immune. Sometimes, they just don't work. Most of the mumps cases in the midwestern outbreaks were among people who were vaccinated not those who were not. There was a recent warning about the chicken pox vaccine that kids are now getting it older and developing much more severe cases, many of whom were vaccinated. The flu shot only protects against a few strains each year, which they have to estimate in advance so there's no guarantee that getting it will protect you or anyone else against the flu that year - it depends on how accurate they were on predicting which strains will be around. Only young children get pertussis vaccines as it's not usually serious in adults so many adults walk around with the illness not even knowing they have it. Unfortunately, immune-compromised people are at risk from both vaccinated and unvaccinated people.
Definitely what GTTO said. For those of you who think that measles, for example, is just a mild illness that leaves you feeling groggy for a couple of week, go onto a site called Left Brain/Right Brain, then into archives and then onto "Just Saying". The video is a graphic depiction of the impact that the diseases that we have vaccinations for can cause. I will warn you that it is VERY graphic, but very truthful as well.Dear Amy,
Forgive me if you've already posted this...But do you see a DAN! doctor? Your children can be tested for heavy metals and evaluated for other possible contributing factors. Immunizations are NOT the only potential cause of autism. My son got all of his shots up until now, except for this year's flu shot. As posted before, I'm separating the MMR if he tests negative for antibodies to measles.
Don't focus on the past...Focus on today and what you can do for improvement for the future!
Blessings!
[QUOTE=bznstchr]Andrew's Mommy...what should we do about Pediarix? It contains Diptheria, Pertusis, and Tetanus, Polio and Hep B...we are thinking about switching practices to be able to break this up.
[/QUOTE]
Hi again! I am AGAINST it. Until the medical community can PROVE to me that it is safe to give a child this many shots at one time, I would request they be separated. I am okay with the DTaP (diphtheria, pertussis, tetanus), and even adding the Hib to this MAY be okay, but beyond that...NO!
I do not feel comfortable with the new rotavirus vaccine. I did not feel comfortable with the first one either! All the docs who say these new shots are "safe" make me a bit upset. What about the Lymerix for Lymes Disease, for example. I was heavily detailed onthat by the company and pressured to buy/give it when I had my own solo family practice, but I said no, thank goodness...!
And for the record, I think it is INSANE to require young women 10, 11, 12, or what have you to get the new "cervical cancer" shot. I think that it is wonderful that Merck developed it, but the states who are jumping on the requirement bandwagon are making me mad!
Off the soap box now
I don't think it's a suprise that the age group where autism is rising so rapidly is correlated directly to the period in which children began receiving a lot more vaccines, many of them with Thimerosal, and also the combined MMR (which was nothing but a money-saving combination). [/QUOTE] Just a comment on this...The MMR, and other combo shots were developed not only for $$$ but also to ensure that all or most children got all of their vaccines. Even before the combo shots...Yes, I remember a time when most shots were individual, there was an increasing urgency to get children vaccinated, especially those who were not able to get to a doc for socioeconomic reasons. I finished Med school in 1989 and Residency in 1993, and we were trying to get children caught up on their shots. They had fallen behind because of $$$ issues, broken homes, lack of knowledge, etc. The combo shots sure helped. The state of VA has a program to immunize children who have no medical insurance or whose insurance plans do not adequately cover vaccinations...This was to HELP the children, not to give them autism... Also, please remember that autism was NOT COMMON 20 years ago. I spent alot of time studying OB and peds in my training, I even took extra peds in internship and residency, and I NEVER saw a child like my son! Okay, about thimerosol. The flu shot is made basically with or without. But very little without is made. Most chidhood shots being produced today do NOT contain Thimerosol. There may be some old unexpired stock bottles being used, which our government so kindly allowed (sarcastic), but the last thing these vaccine companies want is to add fuel to the autism fire by continuing to use thimerosol as a preservative unless ABSOLUTELY necessary. Oh, and if most docs that you've met have laughed at your concerns about thimerosol and/or vaccines and autism, FIRE THEM!!! I have worked with various family docs over the years both older and younger, male and female, and I have never heard that "opinion" expressed. Disgraceful! Here is something interesting about the chicken pox vaccine. DS Gabriel had the vaccine and now he currently has the chicken pox. I read a Statistic online that said 80% of children vaccinated against the chicken pox will not get it. Of course my son has to be one of the exceptions! I vaccinated Gabriel with all the ones the peds recommend up to 3 years old. I am having his titer (sp?) checked before he gets the MMR again With the twins (21months) I stopped all vaccines at 9 months. I am not sure when I will start them again but I know i will space each one out by at least six months. Also, check your state reqs for the vaccines. They are not necessarily the same as the CDC. In PA for example, you need 2 doses of Measles but only one each of mumps and rubella. I would also skip the new Rotavirus vaccine as it has not been on the market very long. And, be careful of the flu shot. My son had a bad reaction to it at 10 months - he ended up with an egg allergy which would have exempted him from the vaccine. He also got one with mercury in it before I knew any better. After the flu shot, he ended up with "unexplained" hives and GI illness that lasted about a month and seemed to freeze in his development for about 6 months. Luckily, he seemed to recover. He's never had one since (he's now 3 1/2) and gets sick much less often than many of his peers who do get the flu shots. And, his pediatrician who is very pro vaccine assured me that the flu shot really is not necessary for healthy children. I'm due to have baby #2 any day now and have been doing some research on delayed schedules. There's a good book called "What your Doctor Doesn't Tell you about Vaccinations." We're planning to delay all vaccines until 4 months and then spread them out so only 1 or 2 at a time. We're going to start with the DPT and Hib. Definitely delaying Hep B and will delay and separate MMR starting at age 3. Skipping Chicken Pox, Rotavirus and Hep A. [QUOTE=jen78fl] For those of you who have waived all vaccines for your child, have you run into any problems with sickness? [/QUOTE] Jen - in answer to your question, no, as far as childhood illnesses go, I have had no problems with any of my children because they are not vaccinated. I pay attention to their nutrition and do what I can to naturally boost their immune systems, so we rarely have any real problems except for the occasional drainage/ sniffle when the weather drastically changes. My older girls had chickenpox, prior to the introduction of the vaccine. Tetanus shots, and get boosters every other year are the only vaccines the children get, primarily because of our immersion in and around horses. AndrewsMommy is right though - not vaccinating does have its responsibilities too. In response to the issues raised regarding school, yes, you can run into problems if you don't maintain the proper paperwork. Each state differs as to what waivers it will accept, but school districts must accept a student if they have one of the legally-accepted waivers. I've never had an issue regarding enrolling my children in public or private schools/daycares with the proper affidavit or waiver. You just have to make sure the "t"s are crossed and the "i"s dotted. My husband and I are both teachers un Upstate NY, there have been outbreaks of pertussis in the last 5 years...mostly in middle schools. We certainly wouldn't want to carry home something like that to an unvaccinated baby. My pediatrician said there is currently a little boy from her practice in a rehab center recovering from a case of pertussis. "What Your Doctor May Not Tell You About Childhood Vaccines" By Dr. Stephanie Cave is an excellent book that gives you the pros and cons of vaccinating and offers an alternative vaccination schedule in the back of the book. Andrew's Mommy...what should we do about Pediarix? It contains Diptheria, Pertusis, and Tetanus, Polio and Hep B...we are thinking about switching practices to be able to break this up. Hi everyone. Well, I have pretty much decided that my son wont be receiving any more vaccines and that any future child I have won't get any either.. For those of you who have waived all vaccines for your child, have you run into any problems with sickness? I just dont think its likely that a child will get measles, mumps or rubella, diptheria, tetanus, pertussis, etc.. I am just curious to know others opinions on this. Thanks!! Jennifer I've got to agree with 23red and derocas here. My wife hates the vaccines. We keep a primarily organic household and she is very "holistic medicine" oriented. She had done all of her homework on these things and spreading them out and having them be thimerisol free was huge. Some you can skip, but others are really important. There have been a lot threads on this and even a recent one. Check them out!
If you do decide you are going to a DAN doctor, you and the doc may decide just to hold off until you resolve any health issues. Then you can decide at a later date about which vaccines your child may need. At this point, my first 2 will not be getting vaccines for a while simply because of all their immune related issues we have had to try and fix. My newborn (EDD July 07) will only receive certain vaccines, but I won't start those until after his immune system is fully developed (after the age of 2-3yrs). Dear Jen, I would strongly recommend "selective immunization" as opposed to no immunization! Yes, there are still cases of the measles, and pockets of mini-epidemics periodically. That is partially why the pre-K MMR booster was added. Also, if your children are not immunized at all, they can put others at risk, specifically pregnant women, cancer patients, AIDS patients, to name a few. Here is what I recommend (Reminder, I'm a family doc): No shots at birth (unless you, the mother are + for Hep B)...Wait until about 2 months or so...Get the DTaP series...Diphtheria and Tetanus have not been associated with autism. Acellular Pertussis is a much safer form of vaccine than previously. Pertussis is Whooping Cough and the numbers of cases have been rising. Check for thimerosol free vaccine. (For all vaccines!) Consider refusing the Hep B series. Get the Polio Shots. This is no longer the liquid form. I have heard no association with autism. For the MMR (live virus vaccine), it is the rubeola or measles component that is most concerning regarding autism. I recommend the first MMR at or after 15 months It can be separated into its 3 components and given at separate times. For the 2nd MMR, request a blood test be drawn to determine if antibodies are present. If your children are immune, skip it. If not, request that the three immunizations be given separately with at least 1 to 2 months in between each. (This is what I am doing with my son's pre-K MMR). The varicella = Chicken Pox Vaccine is a live virus vaccine and can be skipped (I didn't skip it for my son), but it's better for your child if they then get the chicken pox to produce the antibodies needed. Remember to keep your child away from others who could be harmed by exposure, however. For the Hib Series, I recommend it. Hib is one of the most common causes of meningitis and ear infections in infants and small children. I know of no association with autism. I do believe in the flu shot, thimerosol free, especially in children with high risk of exposure (day care, child of a health care provider for example). That should get you started if you change your mind. Please do not take this personally, but ALOT OF RESPONSIBILITY comes with choosing to go without all immunizations. Good luck and God Bless! Interesting about Chicken pox. Our Ped on friday said that public health folk are now ADDING another chicken pox vaccination to improve efficacy, at age 5? My son received all of his vaccinations but never received the booster for MMR. Instead we had his titers (sp?) read. We decided to spread out the vaccines and our ped. was great and understood why but the school was really on top of us. My son is now ten and when he started his new school at 9 they made my doctor's office fax over the exact reading from the titers (sp?). I just wanted to let you know that you might run into problems with the school. A lot of schools will accept a religious exemption if you've never given any shots to your child but will really give you a hard time if you started vaccinating and then stopped. I'm not questioning your decision one way or another I just wanted to tell you it's going to be a difficult battle to keep your child in school. Patty Hi Jennifer, I really don't think it is wise to withhold vaccines from your kids. The reason kids aren't getting measels, mumps, etc., is that they are vaccinated--the viruses are still out there? Look at something else, like spreading out vaccines. The age recommendations for vaccines are just that--recommendations. My ped has been awesome and sensitive to my desire to spread out vaccines. I split the MMR and with each well visit, we get maybe one shot. I would hate for my child, or anyone else's for that matter, to die from a disease that can be covered by a vaccine. I totally understand your trepidation--we all probably have the same one--but autism is not fatal--mumps, measels, rubella, polio, pertussis--they all can be. Good luck with your decision I have already mention that I teach at a high school in upstate NY...we had a case of measles by a staff member 3 years ago. All employees had 24 hours to prove they either had the disease or we immunized...some we home for 3 days waiting for blood tests results to prove they had the disease. I had an epiphany while reading all of these posts. A friend has a 1 year old she has decided not to vaccinate. I have an 8 week old that I was not going to vaccinate. All of a sudden I found myself avoiding playdates with her because I didn't want her 1 year old unimmunized child around my newborn who hadn't yet been vaccinated. I realized that he needs to be vaccinated...no matter how scared I am. I am going to take everyone's advice, especially Andrewsmommy, and slowly vaccinate my little guy. The project today is to find a peds office that will work with me, not against me. Thanks for all the good input. If you still choose not to vaccinate...I get it. It is a scary, scary idea. Best of Luck. [QUOTE=foxl]Our ped. said 1 shot provides only 70%; the second, 85 - 90% ... so in other words 30% of vaccinated kdis, if exposed would get it?[/QUOTE] Actually, that may not be true. The CDC website specifically states that the MMR is NOT a booster shot as everyone seems to believe. They say that the ONLY reason they give it again at 4-5 yrs is to catch the 2-5% of the population who did not develop an immunity when their received the first MMR before 2 yrs. Here is the link: http://www.cdc.gov/nip/vaccine/mmr/mmr-faqs-hcp.htm About 2%-5% of persons do not develop measles immunity after the first dose of vaccine. This occurs for a variety of reasons. The second dose is to provide another chance to develop measles immunity for persons who did not respond to the first dose The second dose of MMR may be given as early as a month after the first dose, and be counted as a valid dose if both doses were given after the first birthday. It is convenient to give the second dose at school entry, since the child will have an immunization visit for other school entry vaccines. The risk of measles is higher in school-age children than those of preschool age, so it is important to receive the second dose by school entry. The second dose is not a "booster"; it is intended to produce immunity in the small number of persons who fail to respond to the first dose. The funny thing I want to mention is that doctors may not know everything. I remember asking our doctor about thimerosal in the vaccine, specifically the MMR. He stated there was only trace amounts. Come to find out later that it isn't true because the MMR contains live viruses and the thimerosal would kill them or render it less effective. I was referencing Chicken Pox vax, not MMR, actually.
Jaden caught pertussis at 12 months old, after being vaccinated against it three times. [QUOTE=mmmwood22]
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